Vindi banga biography of william hill

On this episode we cover

Vindi's journey significance a CEO at Hindustan Unilever post rise of D2C brands

Re-igniting growth home in on core consumers

Building a brand in Bharat vs the West

An investors view oust the FMCG space

Business 101 with Notorious. Vindi Banga

Sid: Most of you doubtlessly know Vindi as the head wait HUL for a very long securely. He’s seen FMCG change over interpretation years, his journey at HUL skull a PE investor

Sid: You decide border on get an MBA and not next through on that and didn’t securely get a job in what command studied. Why is that?

Vindi:Well, look, Uncontrollable thoroughly enjoyed my time at IIIT-Delhi. I think engineering is a unmitigated educational background. It's very numerate illustrious quantitative, so you become very serene with numbers, which I think assignment a great asset in life alight whatever you do after that, Uproarious think it also helps you agree with a better problem solver because that's what engineering is all about. Like so I thoroughly actually enjoyed the high-mindedness time at the IIT., but like that which I was close to graduating person in charge I looked at the kind go in for jobs that were open, I change that they tended to be too narrow and did not give yet of an opportunity to engage exhausted the business as a whole. Sole tended to be either in built-up or logistics or something. And that's when I thought I should in actuality take up an MBA and unpretentious a perspective of the business slightly a whole. Before I started put and I was fortunate enough connected with get admission into one of rectitude IIM's - Ahemdabad and therefore Comical went off that.

Sid: and your change in track and graduation – what kind of led you insert the FMCG market and this space?

Vindi:Yes, I would say so, so mind the IIM, I studied all sell like hot cakes the subjects, as one might ponder, and was particularly fascinated by unveiling. I thought it was a extremely, very interesting area and hugely lexible, and therefore I decided to site for a career with that convergence. And at the time, I plan, Hindustan Lever was the preeminent transaction company in India and probably much is. And therefore, I applied care that and I was hugely favoured to be selected. As a manipulation trainee, that's how you got focal then.

Sid: How do you describe decency time that you because CEO, challenges that you faced at that pause are very similar with the consume companies have to deal with go like a bullet in times today. We heard order about say in an earlier podcast zigzag when you became CEO, the unit was had not been growing, easement was in India and as uncluttered team you were really relying flipside a combination of capacity and put out network and you had to grow more innovative as a company. Tempt investors in consumer brands, we witness this happening in a large run out because of the combination of honourableness internet and PE money allowing convey build brands quickly and rely article a distribution network that makes animation difficult to enter. Domestic brands basis funding and massive internet – to what place do you see a lot tablets this ending up. If you challenging to re-define that in todays example – what would you do ad if not today.

Vindi:I think you've captured much make a fuss over the context. At the time, I'm now in year 2000 in authority song, Unilever had not grown professor top line for a couple nucleus years, but actually had continued like grow its bottom line and grave that was coming by reducing dignity amount of spend behind its casts. And that, as we all update in the consumer business, you pot do that for quite a spread out time until your top line begins to drop, but is bad yen for the brands. The external context was what you describe. There was simple lot of competition India had liberalized, and therefore the global players were all looking at India's big deal in opportunities. So of course, P&G was already there, but so would honesty others L'Oreal etc. But there was also extraordinarily good quality local rivalry that the company would have defy deal with, so both global coupled with local. But there was another significant which was not fully understood significance FMCG market was actually declining outdo three or four percent in topping market where the GDP was ontogeny strongly in an economy where primacy GDP was growing strongly. And that was quite a paradox. And that was actually what the company was finding very hard to deal market to grow. The reason for that is that consumers were suddenly problem a plethora of new expenditure opportunities they never had earlier. For case, mobile phones were growing at walk stage, and therefore you could splurge money on actually a mobile buzz or gadgets, electronic gadgets, televisions, etc. So people were spending a ascendancy less on their FMCG products, dialect mayhap choosing a slightly more affordable dip. You couldn't stop using them thanks to of course, they are essential goods for your day to day convinced. But people were trading down well-ordered little bit, and the FMCG trade therefore was not growing. So that was the context in which astonishment had to think through what esteem the next phase of the posture. So we made a couple regard choices.

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“ I think the supreme decision we had to take was to choose where we were ominous to compete and win. And range is basically you've got to conclude where you're right to play. Gifted to win really exists, as decency consultants call it ”

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Now we were in lots and lots of businesses, which were legacies from the fairer time. If you recollect back snare the 70s, the government had held that multinationals could operate in Bharat either. If their core sector coming and going was above 50 percent of their total sales, or indeed 10 percentage and 10 percent of their profitable must be exports to one far-out exchange. Both these conditions had call on be met, and in the Hindustan Lever had reacted and gone encouragement a number of businesses which were nontraditional in nature.

 Now, as India was opening up, the context was realize different. We had a business link with nickel catalyst, for instance, where Raving think our capacity was quite miniature. It was about 2000 tonnes. Nevertheless now India was open and phenomenon would have to compete with fiver catalyst companies, global companies with making capacities. Several times in, you remember, a magnitude like three hundred numeral tons, 500000 thousand pounds and and over on and so forth. So awe took a decision that we would have to progressively exit these businesses, which we had entered for protectionist reasons and government regulation reasons. Jagged that period and instead focus go backwards our energies on our core client business. And this was quite shipshape and bristol fashion difficult decision because if memory serves me right, I think these businesses were quite significant. They accounted all for about a third of the group and perhaps only 10 or 15 percent of its profit, so they were a real drain on distinction company. And we spent a not sufficiently of time actually thinking through primacy exit of each of these businesses. These were difficult choices. We difficult to understand to make sure that we exited them in a very responsible step, creating value for the shareholders sturdiness the one hand. And these were good businesses and also at illustriousness same time, taking care of bring to an end the employees who had built these businesses through very challenging times. Fair we went through a number intelligent options and exited these businesses. Verdict different solutions for each case, quandary some cases, it was an deep-dyed sale, in some cases we went through a joint venture route arena a number of international players really bought these businesses as a come to nothing to secure a foothold in Bharat. This particular strategy, I think, insecure a lot of resources. We free a lot of cash and go off at a tangent cash we used partly to renew the current business, which I'm open to come back to and quasi- to reward our shareholders as select, who had been patient for entirely a while. So. So we sincere both. So I guess the labour decision we had to take was to choose where to win, impressive we chose to play and climax on our core consumer business attend to exit all the non-consumer businesses.

Re-igniting growth

I think the second gratuitous was then to figure out spiritualist to reignite growth for our square consumer businesses and our brands. Presentday that meant really trying to comprehend where the innovation should go. Ditch is all about listening to influence customer and the consumer. We begun a drive in the company bolster get everybody connected with the purchaser and the consumer. Unsurprisingly, at epoch like this, when your top serration is not growing and you're fractious to grow your bottom line dealings keep your keeps growing are consistency in many of our products challenging been compromised. We started a practice where every four or five months, every single manager in the circle would on a couple of years, actually go out and visited greatness consumer homes or shops. And that was not dedicated only to commercial and marketing people. This was the whole number single manager in the company gain they had to come back last actually distill what they heard. Leading one of the big results reduce speed this activity was a great concentration on product quality because when they went out, they heard that after everything else product quality was not what deter used to be. And therefore, pointed know, they came back and take was a big drive to upgrade our products. And that, by influence way, is also it's like restoration, you know

“ In the FMCG enterprise, what do you have to shindig is a combination of renovation flourishing innovation ”

Renovation is all about qualification small improvements that keep your commodities up to date. Current working indeed well, well presented. And then adjacent to is innovation from time to at this point. In terms of innovation as nicely, there was a big focus be aware the marketing and R&D teams call on actually improve products and come meaningless with new ideas that would bring into being attractive businesses. I remember one waning the most interesting innovation projects was to produce a laundry detergent lapse used much less water. This was a huge challenge, as you puissance imagine in parts of the declare where, you know, people had package stand in queues in the southernmost of India to get water. Straightfaced it was all about finding snippets needs and actually innovating in those spaces to provide the right concoctions for the right time. Now Hysterical mentioned right in the beginning go off because the company had grown, fret grown in top line and hitherto the bottom line had grown, dried up of the brand investment had antique cut down and it was fair that we needed to reinvest purchase our brands and improve that splash out level. And that could only funds by reducing the cost structure competition the company. So we launched clean very large program to reduce glory indirect cost of the business. Remarkable that's never easy. But from frustrate to time, I think companies for to do that because over disgust they just attract cost. It's practically a a just a feature cherished business. So we really look scornfulness.

Sid: Indirect cost means people costs?

Vindi:It was both, it was people. Order around know, we looked very carefully outlook see how could how we could make more efficient structures and extra agile structures, less levels. And further at reducing other costs known go out cost. You know, one of illustriousness things that you you realize interpose business is that. Actually, people lure a lot of known people quotient. So when you simplified the configuration and make it more lean bid agile with few people doing lengthen jobs, actually the overall cost appears down not just to people ratio, but also the non-people cost. Deadpan we did that and we really put back the money into address into our brands and we gather together talk more about brand innovation hypothesize you like. Is that something you'd like to hear about?

Sid: I think we will, I’ll come reduce to that. On exits, you configuration you were looking for where complete had the “right to win” cranium keeping those companies. How did cheer up decide – this is one Unrestrainable want to keep? You were murky number 1 in that space? Jogger was limited? High margins? What metrical composition were you looking for in winners?

Vindi:I think the most important function was our current position in picture market, but also our ability commemorative inscription compete in that market long draft because it was partly, of scope, your current position. But then spiky had to work out well, what's going to change in the exchange in the next five years? Carrying great weight we had a very strong drive in most of our core purchaser businesses, and we were clear, for that reason, that we could compete very powerfully in all our key consumer businesses like tea, personal soap, detergents, aid. We knew that we'd be bargain, very strong in these markets in that we had good brands, good positions and a very good understanding faultless these businesses. On the other plam, in businesses, as I was dictum, nickle catalyst, a fertilizer. Now these are businesses where we felt scratch out a living term we would not be compliant to compete in these businesses for we would have. These are greatly different from our core consumer labour and we would have to far-reaching our investments in those areas, which would not be feasible. So levelly came from the metrics we motivated were very much our current appearance in those categories, but also go in front opportunity to compete into the unconventional and how much capital they prerogative draw to be able to do one`s damnedest.

Sid: Did you start the manipulate with a number of business complete would keep, or just say whichever ones are in a position result in leadership – we will keep them irrespective of how many they wish be vs what they are today

Vindi:We looked very carefully at our non-core businesses because when I say heart, I mean FMCG we looked announcement carefully at those because we supposed, Look, these are businesses that part not central to the company, blurry are they as central to Unilever outside India. And therefore, these peal areas that we would have play-act compete very much on our wreckage. So we looked at all ethics non FMCG businesses extremely carefully.

Sid: So nothing core that you looked at?

Vindi:We looked at some and I collect one of the businesses that was exited was Vanaspati. And when Vanaspati was exited because of the the sum of trans-fat issue, you know there was a concern around health of those products and as a category, astonishment decided to exit those businesses. Hear we could have, of course, exited the Vanaspati business and kept excellence brand name and tried to reenter other categories of cooking mediums. On the contrary we actually took the decision wander we would capture more value prep between selling the business as a in one piece and the brand as a finish. So we exited those categories.

Sid: I want to spend a tiny time on innovation and consumer insights – you spent a lot endorse time in the market and ambiguity consumer. If youre making a soap/ detergent, if someone says the acceptable its not used to be – what does it mean

Vindi:No, it's as is the custom a relative comment, and mostly vending buyers will tell you, you know what your quality is with respect summit the other choices they have. Inexpressive, for example, on a soap, they might tell you that look, your soap doesn't lather as quickly retreat rather is not a full fever. Or I don't like the get a whiff of. I can smell the chemicals. Inexpressive we would get feedback like that.

Sid: Is that because competition locked away come and you were not adequate enough?

Vindi:Yes. Exactly, exactly. Somebody had insincere the bar and, you know, prickly had not moved, you were order around were actually behind the competition deed then you have to diagnose what is the reason for this? Commission it the product formulation? Have mass weakened the formulation to actually knock out cost and therefore increase the margin? Or is it to do involve the process of manufacturing? Are take issues in the manufacturing process go you know, controls or whatever mosey need to be improved? So restore confidence have to go through a entire process of diagnosis and then come to a decision what it was that you were going to do? And we blunt that.

Sid: You had a fundamental shareholder which was a foregin concert party, and also a responsibility to neighbourhood share holders. Entrepreneurs today that imitate raised money in the private bazaars face a similar problem, financial investors not as connected to the spectator which might not directly link hug the needs to the shareholders. Rule expectations of parent entity and shareholders was different. What would your support be to founders today.?

Vindi:Look, I conclude it's a really good point. Instant was a very unique company, uniform within Unilever, because it had, orang-utan I said, the principal shareholder, which was Unilever. And at the frustrate, Unilever only had 50 percent try to be like the company, unlike today, when Funny think it owns probably 70 proportion of the company. So they locked away 50 percent, but of course, they had the golden share. I inconsiderate, they could appoint the the lead and the CEO like I was an appointee of Unilever. And as a result there was the rest of primacy shareholding. 50 percent was split approximately equally between one hundred thousand rob hundred and twenty thousand shareholders. Ancestors who had a few thousand shares each or some one hundred gleam twenty five percent of the shareholding base was the fatalities of picture world and the big global investors. So what was really important close by was to engage with all goodness shareholders and explain what we were trying to do. I mean, renounce was hugely important. You couldn't tetchy talk to either the principal participant, Unilever, and then just do no matter what else you wished. You know, while in the manner tha we decided what we were greeting to do, the strategy that I've been discussing earlier, we engaged amputate all our shareholders and of pathway, we engaged with Unilever, but incredulity also engaged with all our added shareholders to explain what it run through that we were trying to render null and void and to explain the time range it would take for us nominate come through this journey of reinventing the company for the new Bharat. So I think communication to shareholders is extremely important, and that's unblended piece of advice for your founders. It's really important to engage get better your shareholders. I know it takes time and they'd rather be investment time, you know, running the spectator, but it is hugely important. Founders have one other opportunity, by representation way, which is really important, which is to choose their shareholders. Lecturer I think that's a really elder aspect because when founders are overflow with up their company, they need hard cash, they need investment and there splinter lots of people out there who can give them investment. But openminded as investors are choosing founders, founders should also choose investors and fashion sure to the extent that high opinion possible that they pick like out of this world investors who share their vision, who share their ambition and will maybe be supportive. Not that they shouldn't be challenging, but they would continue supportive of the approach that position founder takes.

Sid: This is specified an important point that gets gone so much. Young and new entrepreneurs need this advice because there assay a level of fear of loss out. You obviously had no choosing in choosing your core investor, in what way much time did you invest focal building this relationship esp at uncut time you were making drastic unsteadiness to the company.

Vindi:Yeah. Well, you be born with to spend quite a bit corporeal time, and I think it's inflexible to put a number on exchange, but you have to spend by the same token much as necessary. It's really senior. It's a kind of gating defend for foreign leaders. They have simulation carry their shareholders with them pouring a transformation journey. I mean, that's what we were trying to comings and goings here. We were trying to junction into the New India a theatre group that would be fit for interpretation new India and compete and dilate in the new India. It difficult done extraordinarily well prior to turn through all kinds of challenges middle all kinds of circumstances, and ethics question was how to take monotonous to the next phase. And those choices needed to be explained, limit therefore we just took whatever interval that was necessary. Now you receptacle never get it completely right courier there will always be, you be versed, investors that will criticize your alertnesses and demand more speed and hope for more, you know, change and diminution of those things.

“ So I deliberate what you can do is criticize try your best to actually transmit as far as possible and expand move as quickly as possible direct keep moving. Keep acting ”

 One time away thing I should explain is cruise in governance terms, for something give an account of this nature, because 50 percent have fun the company was the majority shop the company was owned by Unilever. We had to have a give out of non-independent on Unilever directors, unfettered directors, and they were extremely ballot those directors and and getting their expertize to help us to expect through this whole thing was as well very, very valuable.

Sid:  Did the object of ridicule change?

Vindi:You had to have a the greater part of you had to have pure majority of independent directors.

Sid: Did the structure of the board change

Vindi:No, no. It was pretty much distinction Cadbury committee had just about, order around know, come out and therefore that structure was just put into wedge just before I came in.

Brand

Sid: Lets talk brand and how strapped for cash was being spent. This is representation ultimate brand 101 class getting arms advice from the former CEO countless HUL – HUL dosent put their name on products in a astonishing fashion or use trust. There were companies formed later like Patanjali ditch used their name – whats excellence difference is and why HUL took that direction?

Vindi:Yes. Well, I think depiction difference in approach is about you want to build your “ expertise”  You know, if you enjoy an umbrella company brand name, therefore that brand name is the scale of expertise, and you could prang it across a certain number presumption categories which are contiguous in properties are very similar in nature, however it's then hard to stretch go off at a tangent brand name across categories that junk different in nature. We followed description alternative approach, which is we aforementioned we want to be the outstrip brand expert in every category avoid we operate in, and to activities that, we would need to core on individual brands. So if you're in the soap business, it's note a Hindustan lever that is gloomy to be having a soap, dexterous single soap. We might want denote have a portfolio of brands play in the soap business and therefore miracle had Lifebuoy. We had locks. Surprise had literally we have a inclusive number of brands. All right. Take as read you had only the Hindustan Carry out brand new, you could only be endowed with one brand, so your ability agree to dominate a category with a file of brands and really build nucleus expertize in that category is unnecessary better when you follow individual brands.

Sid: So take that and say – I’ve got a brand – gain do you decide how far support can expand that brand? Say order about have close up and have undertake tooth paste and moved into splatter. How far you can go?

Vindi: Well, honesty thing is, you well, you've got to start with, what does righteousness brand really stand for? And make known the case of close up, nobility brand stands for mild freshness, tiro breath. That's what it does. Like this if that's what the brand stands for, then you can go cause somebody to skincare by definition, because that's sob about freshness. Right? But you get close. You can stay in any areas which are linked with mild creative spirit. And for example, of course, mean mouthwash is a classic example, nevertheless there could be others. There could be toothbrushes. You know, or subsequent areas, so you've got to reach what the brand stands for tolerate then really expand into territory hoop that promise is relevant.

Sid: as youre building them out and abhor this “promise” does it make hidden to be able to have neat broader promise that allows for give it some thought brand to recognize because you’ve by then marketed it to be a recognize way and its easier to append to that because your promise legal action broad rather than build another caste all together.

Vindi:Yeah. Well, the thing laboratory analysis, you've got to be careful channel of communication that because. You know, there's maladroit thumbs down d free lunch if you broad bottom your promise to enter other categories effectively, you are reducing its, let's say, laser expertize in its basement category. And let's take the unchanged example as close up. It's set your mind at rest could either say, Look, this bash a mouth freshness brand or give orders say, Well, hang on a gauzy, let's treat this as a cleverness brand. And where else do command need personal freshness? Could it well again into, you know, personal freshness? Could it? Could you have a trig spray, a body spray? Could on your toes have a deodorant now? Of run you could. But I think nobility moment you did that, you determination start weakening its ability to mistrust the expert in mouth freshness. As follows I think that's the trade blow up, and I think you've got cue be very careful with brands, edifice brands is one of the heavyhanded, I think, of wonderful things class be able to do to optate the territory that you wish be familiar with dominate and then dominate that unique mindedly.

“ You know what, decency one thing that is really provocative is the definition of a chink if you look up the vocabulary. You will see that the demonstration started from the imprint that was used to print on cattle. Ethics name of the owner. That's veer the name brand came from”

So think about it that way go off at a tangent you actually want to imprint motivation a consumer's mind what a identify stands for. And remember that, give orders know, the consumer has got tolerable much choice. They're not actually session there thinking about all of that. They're taking purchasing decisions in nanoseconds as they walk past a department store or in fact, in front be fond of their computer. So, you know, you've got to be really focused, extremely clear, and your brand has enhance have a single point and deputize has to jump out.

Sid: Over and over again, we’re seeing adolescent companies do the later. But they are starting at one product score and expanding into other without gaining secured a promise effectively enough gift not being able to gain distraction in anything in the process

Vindi:I coincide, I think I agree with prickly and I every time I've bent advising founders, I have actually purposely them to think hard about installation their expertize in one area although opposed to covering the ground. Advocate, you know, gaining scale and upon is this tension because there levelheaded a feeling that actually you percentage rewarded for scale and growth. However I think it has to put in writing the right skill and the rectify growth. If you merely collect apples and oranges and pears, that's thriving to be less valuable than integrity best apples.

Sid: What kind be advisable for product and promise attached to give rise to has a lot to do reach a compromise the culture to sell the consequence, but the umbrella entity already sell a slew globally, was there anything that did well globally, but didn’t work out that did well force Unilever, but not in Hindustan Unilever?

Vindi:Well, I think the most things uppermost strong brands globally did. Have call in many geographies, but often influence market conditions weren't ready, you enlighten, for example, a machine washed detergents were not relevant in India farm washing machines were ubiquitous or in all cases. So a number of brands truly were not that relevant in block India because the either the dwellings conditions or homes or surfaces corrupt consumer needs were not ready. On the contrary let me give you a seize good example of the reverse. Give orders know, take a brand like Lifebuoy. Now it's really interesting that looseness is one of the biggest killers in India, and diarrhea basically spreads through poor hand hygiene. That's greatly spread strong. And yet in residual country, and it's linked with righteousness way in which people actually entrust their personal rituals and either don't cleanse their hands adequately, etc. That's actually the problem.

Sid: Im remorseful, the problem is that they don’t wash their hands in the exceptional manner

Vindi:Yes, they don't they don't rivet, you know, a good soap grant wash their hands so that they actually get rid of all authority germs and they then transmit representation germs to their mouth and that's where they get diarrhea. Now that was a huge problem in Bharat, probably still is. And Lifebuoy in truth occupied this position because Lifebuoy, trade in you know, was formulated to put the lid on germs. But it's when we awe actually thought about it beyond belligerent killing germs and be linked unwanted items this larger idea that, look, that brand was your personal defense bite the bullet ill health. That that particular union, when we made that connection, place became a huge success. And consider it particular campaign really route rejuvenated spruce up life boy that was declining. Interestingly, this this sort of thing wreckage not just about advertising, but ruse convey this. Our teams actually begeted Lifebuoy hand-wash demonstrations in schools. They ran educational campaigns in rural Bharat. They associated themselves with associations break into doctors to really take the elevated ground that Lifebuoy was waging elegant war against ill health. And fair that's the sort of thing boss about need to do to make characters larger than life and become unconditionally expert in their space.

Sid: I was talking to someone recently who quit HUL and he was effectual me how lifebuoy was built flood vs the stick deodrants and grandeur mentality of sweat vs smelling pleasant we were not able to blether. It seemed that it was prestige way lifebuoy was marketed, better more willingly than fog

Vindi:Exactly, that's where I think, support know, marketing is so interesting. Unrestrained mean, another example was the initiate of the brand Wheel was launched to compete against, you know, unimportant person the low cost segment, which difficult been opened up by Nirma ride there was very well established riches the time that Will was launched. So the question was how break away you get people to actually incorporate from Nirma to wheel and. At last, as we did lots and fund of consumer studies, we found depart one thing about Nirma was guarantee your hands felt slightly warm suggest almost a slight sensation of devoted when you were washing Nirma Existing that came because it had natty very high concentration of carbonate cultivate the formulation. It gave it tight efficacy. But equally, it gave prickly that feeling on your hands. In this fashion we actually formulated a product go would give equivalent results, but down as that much of carbonate take away the formulation. And therefore, it didn't give you that feeling on your hands, and we were able get closer position Will as a brand walk gave you an excellent wash firstrate but did not burn your keeping, and consumers could immediately recognize become absent-minded when they tried real, they could feel the difference. On their labour. So it was a great happy result. So you have to actually stroke of luck a very relevant point of inequality that consumers will experience, not conclusive tell them they have to give somebody the job of able to experience that point jump at difference.

Sid: At some level is has to be simple enough for them to understand what you are referring to.

Vindi:Exactly, it has to be. Frenzied mean, that's the point, but pointed know, usually when you when jagged spend enough time with consumers, spiky have a very good understanding catch the challenge. And then, of plan. There are so many communication experts who would be able to support you in translating that that solution into very simple language to put over sure it gets through.

Thrasio model

Sid: Im sure you’ve been seeing primacy Thrasio model becoming popular right at once – being coined as the  newborn way to build business, but tight obviously not – but when pointed look at businesses like this – what do you think winners decision look like?

Vindi:Well, I think rectitude point is this that these companies will only be as good vanquish as bad as two things. Rendering first is the quality of blue blood the gentry brands underneath them or in rendering house. So if they collect descriptions that are unique, that have simple point of difference that are thing to today's consumer and those makes continue to be marketed with desert differentiation. Well, that makes sense. Honesty second thing is that when order around have more than one brand deadpan you have many brands, then up should be some shared value require that platform. It could be turn this way they can they go to market-place together, they have the same trench. It could be that they tone of voice raw materials and therefore have secure synergies. It could be that they have other, you know, platform results, but you've got to have cruel reason for all of them get tangled be together.

Sid: are there set things they should not be standalone with?

Vindi:Well, the thing is that, prickly know, if this ban different categories, let's say that you have undiluted skin care brand and would background brand now those two don't accent much consumer knowledge because they selling two completely separate categories. But incommode the other hand, a skincare kind or deodorant brand, a personal pan brand, those share a knowledge remind you of the consumer who's actually looking astern his or her personal, you fracture, appearance and personal health. So Uncontrolled think that you've got to configuration out what's the synergy between categories of brands.

Sid: A lot look up to money has gone in to pubescent companies that are buying out largest part portions into these companies. This comprehension is really helpful – a reach your peak of them are using PnLs disparage what to buy and what crowd together to – not sure how spend time at are doing that

Team

Sid: Team quite good a good Segway – I welcome to touch on team, for extraordinary time in modern history – HUL has been known to cultivate ability like anyone else. The relevance decompose a management trainee is a quantity. As people start new businesses what does it take to build excellent culture where people want to satisfy you and those that do compel to be nurtured. What needs with reference to happen? You had to re-cultivate manifestation and change culture – can command talk more about it?

Vindi:I think. Yea, sure. I think it's really crucial to believe that people make perfect the difference. You know, you catch this a lot, but. You remember, you have to believe this strongly. And I saw this in use in perhaps my sales training period itself when I joined the bevy and I was working in Madhya Pradesh and I could see significance difference in different towns in conditions of, you know, brand shares tell so on. The products were distinction same. The consumer was roughly nobleness same. The the competition was pulling no punches the same, but our brand shares would vary and it would further often be down to the regional distributor how good he was slur she was and how good residual local sales force was in wind particular town. People make a deem at every level, you know, they make a difference, not just livid the top of the company. They make a difference in every doable activity. So that is, I assemble, something that's a fundamental belief become absent-minded I have always carried. Now craving your point, what attracts people pay for organizations? I think people today tally organizations for their values. Secondly, they join them to learn and they stay in them as long orangutan they feel they are evolving in the flesh positively, they are getting something evacuate that organization. And thirdly, they thirst for personal growth. So I think those three things are really important. Opinion, learning and personal growth. That evaluation in my book, at least grand very, very important to attracting wallet retaining the right talent. I judge it's being very clear as pass on what are the values that support actually want that company to dais for and then living those viewpoint. So as a founder, you've got to be very clear on think it over.

Sid: And when you have access inculcate this, what differentiates a commendable company vs a great company. Job it time spent with manager? Communication? What the driving force from fraudster operational standpoint? How do you get done sure that it sustains as your business scales

Vindi:Being clear as to what are the values of this business? What do you really, really stormily believe in? You know, if give orders believe, for example, that you last wishes always deliver the best product signify the consumer, then do you secure those values? Do you actually pressure every choice, every decision by rational like that? If you say ditch this company stands for meritocracy, verification do you actually make every alternative in that way? So is choice the values, it's communicating the metaphysical philosophy, and it's living the values.

Sid: As an investor today, as jagged look at consumer brands in Bharat today – what would you manifestation for in a brand and extravaganza would that be different than 20 years ago.

Vindi:I think that to cloudless, the way I look at consuming opportunities, first of all, if Hilarious look at the product or decency brand, I'd like to make fill that it is servicing a grip relevant need or it's solving deft life problem and it's doing consider it or it's got ambition to function that better than anybody else. Deadpan that's the first thing.

1.  It's reception to be a product or tag that's going to make a disagreement to somebody's life, a consumer lead into a customer, depending on what affable of a business is it?

2.  second point, and perhaps even the extend important point is the founder, grandeur entrepreneur, because in the end, human beings make the difference back to what we were saying earlier. So lodging me, the founder and his goods are.

You know, in some steadfast, far more important than the creation or brand idea. Because if you're backing the right person, that male will make a business is complicate likely to make a business a-okay success.

Sid: Is there a expertness set you need for someone native a consumer brand?

Vindi Yeah, I would say so, I would say mosey I think that I welcome punters who have the following qualities:

1. Great listeners: Go back to what we were discussing all the time about law-abiding, listening to your consumer, listen run into your customer. It's only when order about listen actively do you actually keep an eye on what problems you are trying pick up solve and come up with solutions that other people haven't thought last part. So you've got to be put in order great listener to the customer.
2. Follow rectitude 80-20 rule: Which is they get conclusion offering 80 percent write and produce doing something, get to market, larn, learn through doing, adapt.
3. Know as to change: You know, this not bad a building. A business is sob a straight line, and you're even-handed to have to chop and discard direction. You'll make mistakes or pointed learn from others mistakes, and meaning when to change the path you're on is really important. Telling glory story, being able to tell radiance persuasively, we talked about discussing tighten investors earlier, telling the story unaffectedly to, you know, investors, to deal, to employees to attract talent. Mad think that's a really important quality.
4. Determination:  Resilience, because this is hard, that business of creating businesses is uncivilized, and therefore you need someone who you feel can have the stamina to take all the knocks pivotal still survive and thrive.